30 Days of training on a horse question-what should I expect?
What should I expect a very spooky, very green 2 year old horse to know after 30 days of training? Is it really 30 full days? How much is the average cost for this that I should expect? What do they do with 60 days of training?
That's a good question for the potential trainers that you are considering…because all of the answers will be somewhat different, and all will have to be precluded with "it depends on your horse and what it can handle both physically, mentally and emotionally."
Each trainer can give you some goals that he/she will be trying to accomplish with your horse in 30 days, but that's all it will be is a projection, if the trainer is honest with you. Now, if/when you do decide on a trainer, make it part of the deal that you see him ride your horse, show you what it can do, and you ride the horse for the first time with your trainer watching and helping…and this I would insist on doing at your place, not at the trainers place.
If this last part of the deal scares off the trainer, then you need to keep looking for another trainer.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 12:58 pm
That's a good question for the potential trainers that you are considering…because all of the answers will be somewhat different, and all will have to be precluded with "it depends on your horse and what it can handle both physically, mentally and emotionally."
Each trainer can give you some goals that he/she will be trying to accomplish with your horse in 30 days, but that's all it will be is a projection, if the trainer is honest with you. Now, if/when you do decide on a trainer, make it part of the deal that you see him ride your horse, show you what it can do, and you ride the horse for the first time with your trainer watching and helping…and this I would insist on doing at your place, not at the trainers place.
If this last part of the deal scares off the trainer, then you need to keep looking for another trainer.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 1:19 pm
30 days is just long enough for a baby to start learning what's expected of it. I know a lot of cowboy trainers will tell you 30 days and they'll hand you back the perfect horse. NOT! A baby is a baby and they can't cram all that knowledge and experience into 30 days!
I require a 60 day minimum on horses I take in and start. I prefer 90 days to get them going strong really knowing what's expected of them and settling in.
30 days is usually just long enough to get one started under saddle properly, if worked with gently and consistently.
Average training cost around here is $550 a month.
True that different horses take different levels of time. But no horse should be hurried through too much at once. Just imagine cramming for a huge test the day before and trying to remember everything asked of you on the paper! It's possible to do ok, but the stress is a little overwhelming!
Also, consider asking for a few lessons to be included with you and your horse near the end of it's training. Different trainers use different methods, and it helps for you to learn what your horse has been learning so you can continue the fine tuning with minimal confusion for you and your horse.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 1:28 pm
I know in the North East it's always just push and go. Instead I've been working with a few different horses and their owners who want to be right there along. So I go up about two or three times a week and charge about 25-35 an hour depending on the case and severity and what is needed for the horses.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 1:49 pm
For a SPOOKY two year old you shouldn't expect anyone to be on that horse's back. There is no use riding a 2 year old, they are immature in body and in mind. Wait until the horse is at least 3 to ride him/her. Until then light round pen training and confidence training would be best. Let the horse grow and mature.
If you MUST ride then I would pay for 60 days of training. Have the trainer do a "crash course" on confidence training and ground work for at least 30 days. After 30 days of riding you will have a green baby to work with. They may be doing W/T/C both directions but they won't understand head carriage or how to use their body. They will do what you ask but you will need to be riding 100% of the time, you can't sit on a young horse and expect a push button ride. My best advice is to understand that 30 days of ridden training is not going to give you a perfect horse. Spend lots of time on circles and transitions!
Your horse will only be spooky if you are nervous and on edge. If you act like the big horse eating monster (a shadow, the wind, a cat, etc.) is nothing then your horse will learn that there is nothing to be afraid of and most importantly they will learn to TRUST you. After 30-60-90 days of training don't expect your horse to be bombproof. Continue to be calm, patient, and unfazed by "scary" things. You horse will follow suit.
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Training OTTB and QHs since 2004.
May 23rd, 2009 at 2:33 pm
It depends a whole lot on the trainer, and a little bit on the horse. I have trained many colts to ride, and I think after ten rides the colt kind of settles down and starts to have things figured out. After thirty rides, you should be able to take this horse out on his own, or in a group, or handling cattle, and basically able to respond to whoa, walk, trot, canter, turn both directions, and handle pretty well.
However, I was given a colt to train that the owner couldn't even touch, and whose mother had also been completely wild. He was appropriately named "Coyote" and we did get a saddle on him twice, but that's about it…he was so skittish, mistrusting, bucked real hard with the saddle and even ran into a fence post with it trying to get the saddle off his back, bent it up real bad, but it stayed on. We handled him quite a bit on the ground, basically had to halter break him and everything (he was three years old) and then sent him back to the owner and didn't charge them anything. All this to say, it does depend on the horse and its mentality and disposition when it arrives at the trainers.
And then of course it largely depends on the trainer. Some trainers charge for thirty days riding, and ride three or four times a week. So after a month, the horse has about fifteen to twenty rides on it, rather than thirty. So ask your trainer how many days a week the colt will be ridden. Hopefully he'll be honest with you.
My brother just bought a horse for his wife. (BTW she knows nothing about horses, she picked the horse because it's beautiful and black) The seller told them he had been at a professional trainer's for sixty days. When they went to look at the horse, she didn't ride it for them to watch. She allowed my brother to get on, but she held the reins the entire time and walked around the indoor arena leading the horse. My brother told me this on the phone and I just snorted….green broke? Yeah, right!
Well, his wife was still set on it, so they asked us to come take a look. I am pregnant and not inclined to get on a horse I don't know well for the duration of my pregnancy, and so I watched her lead my brother around the arena again with this horse. The horse appeared nervous, and he asked her to let go and he'd ride alone. The horse spooked as soon as she let go, and trotted to the rail and stopped, acting like he had no idea of what to do. The whole time she was talking about him and how great he was, a slow boil was beginning inside me, and building up rapidly.
I told my brother to get out of there. If he wanted to offer her $500 for her unbroke horse, fine, but that was all he was worth, and that was based solely on color and conformation (he was of no particular breeding, other than having solid paint papers). Well, he argued, she had spent $1200 having him trained, and she needed $2500 for him. I said forget it, that's her problem for hiring a bad trainer. I asked the seller if the horse had been ridden outside, in the open, or out of the arena. She said "I don't think so." And she had assured my brother that this horse was about as far along as you'd expect a sixty-days-ridden horse to be.
I was SO MAD! My brother grew up on a ranch, he's ridden good ranch horses his entire life, but never had a big interest in them, or trained any. I told him he was stupid if he bought this horse, and that the only thing to be done was to pay another trainer to finish the job and MAYBE they'd have something in the end result. So that's what they did, because she just had to have this horse.
Anyway, all that to say, watch out for bad trainers, bad sellers, stupid people, and…..sorry, can you tell this really irks me? I'm just sad he asked for my help and advice, and then totally ignored it when I gave it to him. But if I had ridden that colt for sixty days, you would be able to lope out and round up cattle on it. I'm not bragging; I'm just saying that's what training is, not leading it around an indoor arena! So please get a good trainer if you're going to spend money on one!
Good luck with your horse, and sorry I rambled on. Here's my concise answers to your four questions:
1. After 30 days training, the colt should walk, trot, canter, turn both ways, stop, back, and know the basics of carrying a rider. The horse won't be predictable around scary objects, and will still maybe have some buck in him, but an experienced rider should be able to get the horse to obey basic commands.
2. Some trainers might ride the horse 30 times before sending it back (that's what I always did, even if it meant keeping the horse for two months, I got thirty rides in.) But most of them today round it off to riding 4 or 5 times a week, equaling 20 rides or so.
3. Average cost for a month of riding is anywhere from $300 to $700, for just basic training. A trainer like myself with no name and not a big clientele might do it for cheaper (sorry, I'm pregnant, so can't do it
A trainer with a large barn and big name in cutting or reining or jumping might charge much more than that.
4. Sixty days training just kind of moves the colt from being "green green" to "green broke". I'd expect the colt to have better reining skills, but still be direct reining in a snaffle, have a good stop on him, and be able to go out and accomplish a job (work cattle, go along on a long trail drive, begin learning to jump or perform reining or dressage type maneuvers, etc.)
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May 23rd, 2009 at 2:55 pm
Usually when a trainer is going to put on 30 days, it means 5 or 6 days a week for a month. How far he'll or she'll get with the horse in that time depends on the horse's temperament and intelligence,how he's been handled so far, and how experienced the trainer is. Generally, though, after "30 days" a green horse should be able to walk, trot and canter under saddle, stop well, turn left and right (direct rein only, probably not neck rein yet, for most, though occasionally some very sensitive horses take easily to neck reining basics), and back up. Should stand quietly to be mounted from either side, and stand quietly after you get on. A very spooky horse may not get this far in all areas in 30 days. He has to be desentized to a lot of stuff before the next steps can be taken. If a horse has been well-handled by the owner, touched all over, sacked out, etc., then a lot more can be accomplished by the trainer in 30 days. 60 days refines the the horse's response to all aids, and generally gives the horse more experience in various situations. The horse's training has to be systematic and consistent, building little by little on what he's learned day by day. Cost depends on what part of the country you are in, usually includes feed, etc. so hay prices in your area will reflect in the fee. Watch out for trainers who either do not work your horse 5-6/days per week, as they promised, or cheat by having a (unexperienced) student work with your horse,rather than doing it themselves. I've seen both occur.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 3:14 pm
The amount this horse knows before it goes to a trainer will hugely influence what will happen there.
Ideally your two year old should lead very well, back easily from the ground, move his hip and shoulders easily off pressure. He should lunge at all 3 gaits and understand all the cues, including whoa. He should have been sacked out with a huge variety of things, and hauled and exposed to different enviroments. He should handle his feet well, stand quietly to be brushed, and know to drop his head to pressure on the halter. In my opinion, that is the very least your two year old should know before going to the trainer.
You said your two year old is VERY spooky, VERY green. In that case, you are going to pay a trainer to do all this initial stuff for you, and it won't go fast. Your horse will need to learn to both trust and respect the handler, if he doesn't have that now, then that will have to be the first priority.
I personally also would have had this horse saddled numberous times, and ground drove at all three gaits with a sidepull. I would probably have bridled it as well.
If your young horse as all those things done, than 30 days will get them to begin to learn how to learn. That's about all. They should learn to drop their nose to pressure. They should learn to give their heads to the side and then follow their head. They should learn to be ridden at a walk, trot and canter, and to halt from all those paces. They should back a short distance under saddle. They should beggining to get a pivot on the forequarters and hindquarters. They should have worked over groundpoles and other natural obstacles.
And that is about it.
30 days is nothing when it comes to education. Think - we know that people are much, much smarter than horses. But when we send your babies to kindergarten, they go 3 days a week for many, many months and learn only the basics. When they are mentally mature for grade one we send them 5 days a week, six hours a day, for 10 months, and even then they are just beginning to learn to read and understand simple math concepts.
Your young horse is no different. The first 30 days with a trainer has a few main goals - to respect and try for the trainer. To trust people. To move off pressure. To understand how to move forward and then slow down.
60 days will get your horse more consistent with these things. it takes hundreds of repititons for a kid to learn the multiplication tables, and its no different for horses. The more times they do something, the more they really understand what you want and the best way to do it. Millions of horses can canter a circle around an arena. But how many can do it at the exact speed you want, with their nose slightly tipped in, giving at the bit and flexing, and prepared to halt the moment you ask?
What is the cost? It varies enormously depending on where you live, and the type of trainer you hire. Here in Canada an all-round trainer could cost anywhere from $500 to $700/month, that would include their board. A show trainer will cost about $800/month. Many trainers will not take a horse for only 30 days as they know its too short a time, I would be hesitent to send my horse to that sort of trainer as I would know they intend to push my horse really hard, both mentally and physically, so it will look as though my horse learned something.
Lastly, a good trainer will give you a written description of what the horse has learned at the end of their time there. They will give you a few lessons so you can apply the things the horse has been taught. Many will video tape the horse at the end of training, showing what it can do (Its proof for them if the horse goes home, isn't handled right, and starts having problems)
I would do alot more work and handling with this horse so that when you do send him to a trainer he is no longer very green and very spooky. Your trainer and horse will thank you for it, and you'll get your money's worth better.
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I own, show and train Paint horses in Canada.
May 23rd, 2009 at 3:54 pm
for thirty day green break thats just what you should expect. I charge 600.00 a month and in 30 days you can ride your colt, he will be bridal wise, back, walk , trot, and canter and you should be able to ride him out by his self or with other horses. They really need 90 days to get a good grip on what you are teaching them.
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May 23rd, 2009 at 4:27 pm
With a very spooky horse, 30 days should get your horse solid on all ground training that means your horse should walk, trot, canter and whoa on voice command only on a lunge line. He should accept all necessary riding gear like saddle, bridle, girth and bit with little or no resistance and an overall relaxed attitude. Your horse should be able to do transitions from the walk to trot, trot to canter and trot/canter to whoa on voice command only on the lunge line. Your horse may or may not have mastered the transition from the walk to the canter or from the canter to the walk. Young horses must be relaxed to make this transition dependably on the right lead.
Since your horse is spooky and young, the first 30 days will likely be about trust building and the trainer may not even get on your horse to ride until the next 30 days start. In the next 30 days, you could expect the horse to accept weight of the rider on his back, stand mostly still for mounting, walk, trot, canter, whoa and back up a few steps. Your horse will also begin to learn the leg cues for these gaits. Your horse should be more relaxed when working and should understand the basic job that he will be asked to do. A 60 horse will not be "finished" but will have a good idea of what is expected. With time and practice, you can reinforce these early lessons at home to refine your horses training over time. Average cost for training starts at about $350 a month and goes up to about $650 a month. A cheap trainer isn't necessarily the best deal and the most expensive isn't the best either. You need to know who will actually be riding your horse. Often it will be an assistant trainer or even regular barn help, so make sure you meet the people who will actually be training your horse, not just the main trainer. Hope this helps. Best of luck!
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